Subsequent month, Nightdive Studios will launch System Shock 2: twenty fifth Anniversary Remaster for consoles and PC platforms. Forward of that launch, I had an opportunity to talk with Nightdive Studios’ Stephen Kick concerning the upcoming launch, the unique System Shock 2, the way it led to forming the studio, sport preservation, potential Nintendo Swap 2 upgrades, engaged on consoles, DOOM, Quake, how issues modified below Atari, and likewise Deftones and Espresso.
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This interview has been barely edited for readability.
Stephen Kick:
I’m formally the studio head at Nightdive and I have been doing this for most likely about 13 years. Would you like slightly little bit of background on how the studio obtained began?Stephen Kick:
I will attempt to summarize it. It is a story I like to inform as a result of it is a enjoyable story that not many individuals have had the chance to expertise and simply form of how I obtained right here is fairly wild. I used to be within the uh within the online game business for a lot of years. I labored at Sony as a personality artist. My fiancee on the time, we obtained form of burned out working within the business so we determined to take a break and we drove our Honda Civic throughout the border into Tijuana, Mexico and mainly traveled by Mexico and Central America for 10 months. Throughout that point I used to be rediscovering my love for PC gaming and so I obtained to replay lots of my favourite video games on an previous laptop computer. Fallout, Full Throttle, curse of monkey island, and one night time i attempted to play System Shock 2 and i could not get it to run. and that i additionally could not discover a technique to legally obtain it or a minimum of a working model of it. 
Stephen Kick:
Yeah it was just a bit Google Chromebook. We tried to pack as flippantly as we might as a result of the objective was to have the ability to match all the things that we had into the trunk of the Honda in order that nothing could be disregarded within the again seat for apparent causes. The laptop computer we introduced was simply this little underpowered machine that was solely good for textual content paperwork and 90s period PC video games.In any case, I made a decision to attempt to determine what occurred to the rights of the sport. In order that night time, I am in the course of Guatemala within the jungle, and I got here throughout an previous article from G4TV concerning the historical past of Trying Glass. How the rights to their video games have been break up up between an insurance coverage firm within the Midwest and EA which printed lots of their video games. So I reached out to the overall counsel at this insurance coverage firm known as Star Insurance coverage, and requested them if they’ve the rights to System Shock. They wrote again nearly instantly saying they did, and if I used to be fascinated by engaged on System Shock 3.
As a lot as I might have cherished to have carried out that again then, I simply knew I wasn’t in actually any form of place to take action. I really useful that they only re-release the previous video games, and that I might facilitate that. It took a few months however we agreed on phrases they usually sub-licensed the rights to me. I then went on to GOG. I mentioned, “Hey I’ve obtained the rights to your primary most requested sport. Let’s put it on the market.” they usually did it. It was like Valentine’s Day 2013, I believe, both 2012 or 2013, and it ended up simply being an enormous hit. From then on, I mainly had been devoting my time to going out and looking for different misplaced classics or video games which have been form of left to the wayside, and remastering them, porting them to new consoles so that everyone can get pleasure from them once more.
Stephen Kick:
Not at first. I needed to mainly redact the licensing settlement that I had with Star insurance coverage Firm and ship that to them to show that I did in actual fact have the rights to try this. I actually do not blame them. I imply, at that time, I was similar to a random man, and I did not also have a technique to contact them formally. I simply went by the “contact us” field on their web site, and it obtained forwarded to any person in advertising and marketing. It form of went up the chain at that time, after which yeah.Stephen Kick:
Yeah, that is a element for positive. I believe that we had like a pair thousand {dollars} by the point we obtained again, and what ended up occurring, is the chance arose. I had the licensing settlement after which I went to family and friends and simply mentioned, “Hey would you lend me some cash? I believe this can be a actually cool alternative.” What was actually nice, is that my pals simply form of implicitly gave me the cash not anticipating something again. They have been like, “Hey you’ve got at all times been there for us. Don’t be concerned if this goes South. There isn’t any strain to pay us again.” I used to be very lucky to be in that state of affairs, after which I coated lots of it myself as a result of as quickly as we obtained again, we simply instantly began working as contractors for numerous indie firms doing art work on the aspect to form of rebuild some some fairness in order that we might transfer out of my spouse’s dad and mom home.Commercial. Maintain scrolling for extra
Stephen Kick:
After I was 18, I used to be residing in Massachusetts and actually did not have any form of plan as to the place I needed to go to high school, or what i needed to pursue. I used to be studying the most recent subject of PC Gamer, and there was an advert in there a few faculty in San Francisco known as The Artwork Institute of California – San Francisco. They have been providing a sport artwork and design diploma. I utilized and obtained accepted. We might discover out 10 years later that these for-profit colleges have been a extremely unhealthy concept. The tutoring was insanely costly, however I did be taught quite a bit. There have been business professionals that have been giving the courses, and initially I got down to be a sport designer. I actually cherished to write down, and provide you with the concepts for video games and the mechanics, in order that’s how I obtained began.After I obtained to high school, we needed to take a lot of courses. We took programming courses, animation, artwork, every kind of stuff, and I actually gravitated in direction of 3D modeling as soon as I obtained there. It was all I did. I simply ate and breathed Maya and ZBrush, and I constructed a extremely robust portfolio. I just about obtained employed proper out of college.
My first job was at an indie firm known as Paleo Leisure in San Diego, and we labored on one of many very first Crytek 2 Engine video games outdoors of Crytek. It is nonetheless on Steam. It went by a lot of title modifications. It is known as Drug Wars. I believe it is nonetheless on there.
After that, I obtained an artwork check at SOE (Sony On-line Leisure) as a result of my fiancee obtained a job there proper out of college. We met on the artwork institute, and she or he graduated a bit earlier than I did and obtained her first job in San Diego at SOE. I form of lower my tooth at this indie studio after which after most likely a few yr, I went and I joined SOE. I took an artwork check and obtained employed to work on an MMO over there.
Stephen Kick:
Yeah, completely.It does, and there is been lots of people which have requested: “Why is that this taking so lengthy? This sport obtained introduced across the identical time because the Kickstarter I consider, which was like in 2016. It initially began off as an Enhanced Version that was going to be PC solely with a lot of high quality of life enhancements past what the neighborhood had had been graciously providing as much as that time, and we have simply gotten concerned to such a degree at Nightdive the place we have have the fitting staff, and we have the expertise to actually convey this to that subsequent degree which is redoing all of the cinematics, updating all of the artwork property, the animations, and fully redoing the multiplayer code in order that it truly works. Not solely does it work rather well, however it works cross-platform by Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, and PC so that you could have a extremely true and steady 4-player co-op expertise.
So it simply felt like we would come full circle. We began from simply mainly simply me releasing video games utilizing off-the-shelf emulators like DOSBox and ScummVM to us having our personal fully-fledged proprietary engine that we port our video games to, and we have actually form of hit that subsequent degree. We thought System Shock 2 was the right sport to showcase that.
Stephen Kick:
Yeah, that is him. That is Bren.Stephen Kick:
I will not converse for the builders. I am positive porting to consoles is tough in its personal approach, however the way in which that our KEX engine has been constructed has, I suppose, eliminated lots of the standard roadblocks you’d have for those who have been beginning with only a sport engine and making an attempt to port it to consoles with out there being like SDKs, that form of factor.I might hesitate to name {that a} difficult factor for our staff anymore. I believe the most important elevate on this sport was basically rewriting the multiplayer code.
Stephen Kick:
Yeah, I might say the one factor that we’re slightly bit behind on now, you talked about, was most likely the PS5 DualSense controller. However all the things else we’re very acquainted with like Steam Deck compatibility. There is a couple individuals on our staff which can be very enthusiastic about gyro controls and the Swap, so all of our video games usually have that performance.There’s form of like a guidelines after we go per platform as to what options we’ll implement.
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Stephen Kick:
Yeah, that is the thought. We have not introduced something but by way of bringing System Shock Remake to Swap, however it’s positively one thing we need to do.Stephen Kick:
Okay, properly you already know what? I will write that down actually fast. One second. After I noticed the mouse assist for Swap 2, that was form of what went by my thoughts as properly. It was like, oh boy, lots of our video games, that is how they have been initially meant to be performed. So it could be nice simply to even have that choice. 
Stephen Kick:
How the KEX engine form of got here to be was, we had been, once more, doing off the shelf re-releases of video games that did not transcend that Home windows 3.1, Home windows 95 form of border simply because we simply had no programmers. We did not have any engineers working at Nightdive on the time. Once we began to have a look at presumably getting the license for Turok, we knew that we have been going to should form of attain that subsequent stage in our improvement as a studio. So I initially began looking out on the web to see if anybody had carried out any mods for Turok. Had been there any compatibility fixes and was there something to make this sport playable on trendy PCs. That is after I got here throughout Sam’s web site, and he was engaged on a full port of the sport utilizing his personal engine.So I reached out to him, and simply requested him if he’d be fascinated by doing one thing like that full-time and making it official. That is mainly the place it began. Sam Villarreal joined on after which he had a bunch of pals within the DOOM neighborhood that he favored to work with who he really useful we convey on, and we introduced them on. All of the sudden we had an engineering staff and Sam was capable of formally launch Turok with the KEX engine.
Since then it is gone by quite a bit. I believe they’re like on model 4 or one thing like that now internally. However yeah, that is how the KEX engine got here to be.
Stephen Kick:
Properly, the engine permits us to mainly take the unique code for a sport and implement all of the excessive degree rendering options which can be required for porting the sport to consoles and it permits us to make use of controllers and totally different inputs and every kind of issues.So actually, accessing that unique code is the most important impediment that we face as of late and that anybody faces once they’re taking a look at bringing again an previous title. Typically, we get fortunate and the code base is clear, it has feedback, it builds on possibly an previous model of Visible Studio, and it may be upgraded and mainly plugged into the KEX engine.
Different instances it will not be in pretty much as good of situation because the programmers would really like, and it requires them to go in and replace issues accordingly. Then the worst case situation is that we won’t discover code in any respect, and we have now to spend an incredible period of time reverse engineering issues. Going again to System Shock 2 25, that is what we needed to do there. We couldn’t discover the unique supply code. So the sport needed to be roughly reverse engineered.
Stephen Kick:
Over 40. We’re a fairly respectable sized studio.Stephen Kick:
I might say at least three at any given time. You’ve got seen our launch schedule. Final yr, I believe we did 5 video games. We prefer to sustain that tempo. It is lots of work. However as we get larger and larger video games, I believe that it will decelerate slightly bit, however the video games that we do launch will probably be a lot grander in scope and scale. 
Stephen Kick:
I believe the licensed element of it was a giant motive why it was profitable. I imply the film has gotta be in my prime three favourite films of all time. I believe there’s lots of people on the market that really feel the identical approach, and there is lots of people that performed the unique. I believe the unique model that was launched within the 2000s bought over one million copies. There’s lots of followers form of inbuilt. You couple that with the energy of the IP, individuals nonetheless speak concerning the film. There’s nonetheless tasks being made with that title and it will get referenced quite a bit. So there’s simply that familiarity that individuals have with it. I believe it actually helped propel The Factor: Remastered to be one in all our greatest promoting video games.Commercial. Maintain scrolling for extra
Stephen Kick:
The true advantage of our enterprise mannequin is that we will form of choose and select what we need to work on. The financial aspect, as good as it’s, is not the issue that form of goes into selecting these items.For PO’ed, which is mainly, it is such as you’re pissed off. I believe that is the moniker. Sam requested that I observe the code down for him for his birthday as a present and I did. I discovered the fellows, the unique builders, they usually nonetheless had the code. We have been capable of do a licensing deal to get the code in hand and Sam mainly did that title from begin to end as a result of it was one in all his favourite video games.
It was a giant shock for lots of people. I believe one, as a result of not many individuals knew of it, after which two as a result of, “You guys simply did a Star Wars sport. What is that this?” That brings lots of pleasure to me personally as a result of I hope that, and I might guess that most likely extra individuals have performed PO’ed now than when it initially got here out.
There’s only a piece of gaming historical past that we plucked, that we have preserved, and it is there whether or not you prefer it or not. Who’re we to say what constitutes artwork, proper? Any individual may say that is the most effective video games ever made and that is all that issues to us.
Stephen Kick: (
Laughs) Properly, Blood II is simply, it is an attention-grabbing prospect to us as a result of we have, we have talked to the unique builders of Blood II and, you already know, they themselves mentioned, “We did not have sufficient time. We did not manage to pay for and this isn’t the sport that we needed to launch.”To me, that is the right sport for us proper now, as a result of with titles The Factor: Remastered and Shadow Man Remastered, and even a number of others, we have had the privilege of working with the unique builders, and we have requested them that very same query, “Hey, now that we will do no matter we wish, what would you’ve got carried out if you had the time with the assets to see this by as you needed?”
With reference to Shadow Man, there have been whole ranges that have been lower. There have been voice strains, there was music, there was all this supporting knowledge that we discovered alongwith some design paperwork and with these, and with the assistance of the, once more, the unique builders, we have been capable of recreate these ranges as greatest to our skill in order that the sport was lastly completed in spite of everything these years.
The Factor: Remastered was the identical approach. We added lots of stuff. We cleaned up lots of mechanics, given the 20 some odd years that it is needed to form of percolate and, and get the suggestions, from all of the individuals who have tried it. I believe Blood II could be the right factor for us to go in and deal with the identical approach.
Stephen Kick:
How do you know that?RPG Web site: I do my analysis.
Stephen Kick: It is humorous as a result of individuals reward me that sport on a regular basis. It occurred at DICE, and one of many guys that we met had labored at Vivendi and twentieth Century Fox or Fox interactive and he is like, “Hey, if I see you at DICE, I’ve obtained one thing for you.”
After I confirmed up, he had a model new sealed copy of the sport. Then after all, I’ve obtained that sitting on the desk and everyone at DICE is a sport developer. All of them came to visit and have been like, “Oh are you lastly engaged on this?”
I used to be like,”No, no, it is only a reward.”
The most recent copy of No One Lives Endlessly I obtained was like two weeks in the past. A good friend of mine despatched me a graded copy of the PS2 model and mentioned, “This might go in your assortment so while you lastly do it, you already know”. That is all I can say. It could be a dream come true to work on it. I will at all times combat to make that occur.
Stephen Kick:
It has freed us up significantly to work on the video games as a result of with each studio, you’ve got obtained lots of ancillary elements of the enterprise that require lots of consideration like human assets and finance and all the things else that goes into supporting a enterprise. Now, we do not have to actually fear about that stuff as a lot, as a result of Atari has introduced their staff in to deal with lots of it. That features authorized as properly which is a giant weight off of our backs.Myself and my head of operations and even our lead biz dev man, Larry, we’re one hundred percent targeted on the video games and the builders now, and we do not have to place as a lot power into these different aspects of the enterprise. It is actually been fantastic.
Stephen Kick:
Dave (Oshry) and I’m going approach again. I met him at one of many final E3s and we have been doing an occasion for GOG truly. He was demoing the remastered model of Rise of the Triad (the 2013 model) and that is the place I met him and we have been actually good pals ever since. Any time that we have now a chance to form of cross over and work collectively we’ll do it. Rise of the Triad Ludicrous Version was a terrific instance.Stephen Kick:
I had no concept the place this may lead. I used to be simply overwhelmed by the response of simply System Shock 2 popping out that to me, it was like, I get to be on this world of basic video games, the world that I grew up in, and assist assist the inventive imaginative and prescient that the unique builders had, and hopefully expose a complete new viewers to these items like that. It was only a dream come true.I did not actually deal with it like a enterprise till a lot later. It was at all times only a factor that was pushed by my ardour for video video games as an artwork type as a medium for expression. You possibly can’t have what we have now now with out what’s already been constructed beforehand and having a component in that in any respect has simply been form of a life altering expertise.
So to have, and to draw the form of people who we have now, and have them be right here for so long as they’ve, I believe is only a testomony to the work we do. It is essential and the people who assist make the video games at Nightdive, they clearly adore it as a lot as I do.
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Stephen Kick:
Oh, completely. We have had that drawback for fairly some time now, truly.RPG Web site: That is a great drawback to have.
Stephen Kick: I might say that most likely across the time of DOOM 64, as soon as we did that title, it was like, we might now not afford to exit and discover video games. It was extra like, how are we going to deal with the inflow of individuals coming to us and asking us to do their sport?
So the entire thing form of flipped on us the place we weren’t searching for work. We have been searching for individuals to come back and work for us to do extra video games. It has been like that ever since and it is nice.
Stephen Kick: I
t truly began with DOOM 64. Our lead engineer had, form of in his free time, been engaged on a port of DOOM 64, and I’ll willingly admit that I by no means performed DOOM 64. I did not have an N64 rising up, and I simply thought that it was a port of the unique DOOM, very like all the opposite ports that have been on PlayStation and Tremendous Nintendo. I believed it was only a port. I did not understand it was in its personal sport so when he confirmed it to me, I used to be like, what, how did a DOOM sport go over my radar or no matter?So we reached out to id Software program on the time, and we proposed the mission to them. They have been fully heads down on, I believe, DOOM (2016). By the point they have been engaged on DOOM Everlasting, they got here again to us and mentioned, “Hey, we cherished that mission. Are you able to get it carried out in time to launch as a pre-order bonus for DOOM Everlasting? Are you able to additionally add in some further missions in order that we will create a tie in to DOOM Everlasting, you already know, some form of narrative bridge between the 2?”
That was fairly a motivator for the staff, that they’d get to create some form of unique content material for a basic DOOM sport. It was acquired so properly, that the following day Bethesda got here to us and was like, “What can we do subsequent? Do you guys need to do that? We obtained all these nice video games that might use this contact.” So our subsequent mission was Quake, after which Quake 2, after which DOOM + DOOM II, and we’ll simply go away it at that. (Laughs)
Stephen Kick:
Not from our aspect. We do not do any cellular video games. The one factor that we did on cellular was that we outsourced I Have No Mouth and I Should Scream by Dotemu. I might like to, in the future. I believe that there is lots of potential there. The DOOM RPGs have been particularly cool. Even when we have been to port these to Swap, I believe these could be wonderful. I might like to personally see a dungeon crawler, however with the System Shock IP in the identical approach. I believe that will be actually cool.Stephen Kick:
So I did not personally work on them, however I obtained to play them. It is simply such a terrific alternative to see how far degree design has advanced since 1996. I imply, you’ve got obtained these guys that most likely, once more, form of lower their tooth on the modding scene with Quake now being professionals at MachineGames and Nightdive attending to work collectively on a model new mission pack. It was a dream come true for all of the builders that have been concerned in it.I believe that it was actually mandatory, and it was actually compelling for individuals to choose Quake up once more to have the ability to play new missions and a brand new marketing campaign.
Stephen Kick:
My favourite one thus far, that is gonna be a extremely robust query, however I believe it is gotta be Darkish Forces. That was one in all my very first experiences on PC, like by myself PC. I’ve simply obtained such robust reminiscences tied to it. Darkish Forces simply actually captured all my creativeness, and I might say, form of put me on this path of eager to finally be a sport developer.Difficult is an efficient phrase as a result of there’s been a lot of totally different challenges over time they usually’ve all been totally different. I might say one in all our most difficult video games thus far has most likely been Sin Reloaded. We personal the rights to that sport, to that franchise, and you’d assume that due to that, it could have been an enormous precedence to get a remastered model out, however we have simply run into so many obstacles. Like initially we have been working with 3D Realms. They have been going to be doing the artwork and serving to out with lots of the designs, however that obtained delayed, and we obtained so busy with different tasks. It simply form of went out on the again burner. We’re nonetheless engaged on it now, however it’s simply been laborious to seek out the time and the assets to offer it the love that it deserves. In that approach, I believe it has been most likely essentially the most difficult for us to lastly launch.
Stephen Kick:
A whole lot of it comes down to simply getting expertise and hands-on with the sport once more. So fortunately, due to all of the individuals at Nightdive and their backgrounds, there’s at all times a gaggle of individuals which can be extraordinarily acquainted with no matter sport we’re engaged on, and so we get that arms on the bottom or ft on the bottom form of method the place they instantly know all of the grievances that individuals have with the unique. To allow them to apply that information and instantly repair lots of these points which have form of plagued the sport for nevertheless lengthy.On the artwork aspect, we simply have an extremely proficient staff of people which have actually refined their skill to take an previous 3D asset, and simply breathe new life into it with out actually altering the aesthetic or actually placing their very own imprint on it. It is like they’ve this skill to translate a mannequin from the nineties and produce it as much as trendy instances, however with out dropping the character and the essence of what that factor was.
I believe it simply comes from expertise. It comes from having to do that on a regular basis with a lot of totally different types and artwork types, that form of factor. It is at all times a problem, however we have the fitting staff to sort out it.
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Stephen Kick:
Hopefully. (laughs)Stephen Kick:
Yeah, truly I have been enjoying by it. The best way that I am form of experiencing that sport, is in small chunks, as a result of I did not need to get by it so quick. I actually needed to get pleasure from and savor it. I play for like 4 hour increments each couple of weeks. I leap in, and I simply get proper again into it, and it is actually been a enjoyable technique to expertise it as a result of I am nonetheless enjoying it after launch. I believe I am actually near the tip, and so I’ve taken a extremely lengthy break as a result of I simply do not need to end it.Stephen Kick:
I imply it could be nice to have the ability to try this, however I believe that these unique video games have been re-released lately, have not they?Stephen Kick:
I can not even say there have been any conversations. I believe it is laborious as a result of the modding neighborhood for these video games is so expansive. There’s such an enormous neighborhood constructed up round S.T.A.L.Ok.E.R. that it could be an enormous enterprise. I imply, these video games are big. The X-Ray Engine could be very, very complicated. I imply, might we do it? Most likely, however making an attempt to collate the years and years of assist that the neighborhood has gone into it and, all the things else, could be an enormous enterprise. I believe for that motive, it simply by no means form of got here to the highest when it got here time to begin searching for video games. It could be fairly superior to finally are you aware, personally.Stephen Kick:
Most likely White Pony.Stephen Kick:
It was wonderful. We obtained to fulfill them. They have been implausible and really pleasant.I gave them little copies of the poster that I had made they usually cherished it which is the most important praise that I ever might have acquired. They have been very grateful. Our tickets have been like proper within the stands, possibly 50 ft away from the stage. We obtained blown away. It was implausible. 
RPG Web site: Was that the primary time you noticed them?
Stephen Kick: No, truly I noticed them again within the 2000s, in Massachusetts. They opened for Godsmack. In order that was an superior present too.
RPG Web site: I lately remembered that Godsmack did an acoustic EP, which had implausible variations of Voices and I Stand Alone. I believe I’ll hearken to it after this interview.
Stephen Kick: I simply noticed a YouTube video from Rock N’ Roll True Tales, one in all my favourite YouTube channels, on Godsmack. It actually introduced me again as a result of I am from Massachusetts and that is the place they’re from. We used to listen to them on a regular basis on our native radio station earlier than they hit it massive. After they got here again to that Boston space for that live performance, they went all out.
The opposite time that I noticed Chino (from Deftones), I went to a staff sleep live performance in San Francisco, which was actually cool.
Stephen Kick:
I do like them. I have not given them sufficient listens as that, because it most likely deserves. At any time when I am in that temper, I at all times simply are inclined to gravitate in direction of Deftones. Nowadays, I hearken to much more of Saturday Evening Wrist and Diamond Eyes than I do the heavier stuff from the sooner days.RPG Web site: I believe you must give the Crosses music, The Epilogue, a hear. I am curious what you consider it while you give it a hear.
Stephen Kick: Yeah. I will put that on after this interview.
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Stephen Kick:
Proper now, I am having an iced espresso. It is a latte with oat milk. That is form of a boring reply, however that is what I usually drink.